244 Joanna Hennon + Holly: Can You Expect Miracles From Doing Transformation Work?

Today’s Guest

Table of Contents

As you may remember, I’m trying out a new format for 2018 with quarterly co-hosts, and my fabulous co-host for Q1 is Joanna Hennon, who has previously been a guest on the show. You can find her on episodes 86, 158, and 178.

Today, we talk about how much transformation we can actually expect from doing transformation work. We’re both big fans of personal development, transformational work, and mindset work, and Joanna has just returned from the PSYCH-K Basic Workshop, which I did almost five years ago. I always say my life is Before PSYCH-K and After PSYCH-K, and in this episode we talk about why this kind of work is so powerful and life-changing.

We Ask These Questions:

What are these transformational tools that we speak of, and how do they work?
What does transformation actually mean?
Why isn’t everyone who uses these tools rich and successful?
Is there really such a thing as a quick fix?
What about non-spiritual people who are successful? How do they make it happen without doing transformational work?
Is there a danger in doing too much transformational work?
Is big transformation actually possible?
How often do we need to do transformational work?
Are we ever really done with this kind of work?

More About Joanna Hennon

Joanna is a #SoulSmart Success Mentor – she helps people to easily create more success by using the wisdom and power we all have access to at soul level. Living life from a place of soul power, in tune with your higher self and your Guides, and using the Law of Attraction with intention will literally change your life! To get started, grab one of these free resources: http://joannahennon.com/freebies/

Listen to this episode

What You’ll Learn

How to create real transformation from using transformational tools and doing mindset work
What’s really possible when you do transformational work
Examples of what real transformation looks like
Why transformation work isn’t enough, and what you need to do alongside it
How to manage your expectations when doing transformation work
Why you need to commit and make it a habit (and what that looks like)

Things We Discussed

Connect with Joanna

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Transcript

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Holly: Hello and welcome to the Business Mindset Podcast, episode 244. This is your host Holly Worton and I am back with another co-hosted episode with the fabulous Joanna Hennon. Today, we talk about transformation. How much transformation we can actually expect from doing transformation work, and mindset work. We are both huge fans of personal development, transformational work, mindset work – whatever you want to call it – and Joanna has just come back from the PSYCH-K® Basic Workshop, which I did almost five years ago. Now, I always say that my life is before PSYCH-K® and after PSYCH-K®, because it marks such a huge difference in my life. And in this episode we talk about why this kind of work is so powerful and so life-changing. I think this is a really good episode and I am really excited to be releasing it to you.

Holly: Hello! It is Holly Worton and Joanna Hennon and we are back with another co-hosted episode. This is a really juicy topic that we are both excited about. We are going to be talking about how transformational are transformational tools? Are they actually transformational? Do you actually get big changes from them? And, if so, why are we not all super successful? So, really excited to just dig right into the episode, so let’s start out by talking about: what are transformational tools and how do they work?

Joanna: Wow! Well that in itself is a big topic! What we were talking about, before we started recording, that transformational tools are the ones that promise transformation at some kind of deeper level, right? So, we were talking about PSYCK-K which you are a fan of, I have just become a huge fan of following a workshop just this past weekend and things like EFT, kinesiology – although that a bit less because you can’t do it yourself. Is there anything else you can do with yourself?

Holly: Well, heart-centred energy work I use with myself. Can you use NLP with yourself? I guess kind of.

Joanna: I am just not an NLP expert, so I don’t actually know.

Holly: No, me neither, I trained in it years ago, but I don’t really ever use it.

Joanna: I think really PSYCH-K® and EFT will do as examples. If anybody else thinks of other tools that promise transformation then you can add them to the list and I think that all of the things that we talk about will apply. So, so yeah transformational tools are tools that promise some transformation of some kind, usually at a deeper level; so, at cellular level, at subconscious level, energetic level; – so any sort of kind of energy clearings as well I think would fall into this category.

Holly: Yes, smudging, as soon as you said energy clearings, I thought of smudging using sage or something like that.

Joanna: Yeah anything like that would…

Holly: Very different, but that’s promising transformation through decluttering the crappy energy.

Joanna: Yeah, or any of those things where you kind of let your negative beliefs or thoughts kind of sink into the ground or let them be taken away. I myself also have a process that I use with clients, where we take the negative stuff out of the body and then let it go. I just wonder how transformational they are and maybe what that means. What does transformation mean to you Holly?

Holly: So, that’s a really important question. So, transformation to me is like woah! big changes, but really it could be small changes too. So, it could be changes in how you feel, changes in your beliefs, changes in the sense of releasing blocks, changes in how you approach things, changes in perspective. It is change really.

Joanna: I think, as you were talking, I realised that my definition of transformation has really changed since I set out on the personal development – and even on my own business entrepreneurial journey. And I think now I can appreciate that transformation can be both big and small and that it is really about my quality of life and that things are easier for me and I have more clarity, and stuff like that. Whereas I think that when I started, I think what I expected from – I was doing EFT at the time – was like huge results. I remember tapping until my face was like…{laughing} I mean it wasn’t sore, but it was… I used to tap for ages and it was all around how I wanted more money to be flowing in my business and I expected that to actually transform my reality. Is that what’s meant by transformation?

Holly: I think that is one of the types of transformation. So, how did you start out on this transformational journey? How did you first start thinking about the fact that you could have transformations in your life?

Joanna: I can’t even remember how I came across EFT. EFT for anybody is listening and doesn’t know, is ‘Emotional Freedom Technique’ better known as ‘tapping’ and if you want to know what it is more specifically you can YouTube it; it is basically tapping on certain points on your face and body. It is the acupressure points, it is acupuncture but without the needles. I just remember thinking that this is a really easy tool, I wanted this big change in my life, I was in a job and I started a business and I wanted that business to be like immediately successful and be bringing in loads and loads of money and then somebody showed me EFT and I was like: ah cool! So, if I do this everyday surely by next month {Both: laughing} …it will be done! And I think that ‘done’ bit, from my perspective now, I think the ‘done’ bit is the problem, because maybe sometimes at the beginning of our journey, or at some point, that’s what we think, that transformation is ‘done’.

Holly: Yeah, exactly, it is like there is an end to the journey. Like, I am going to get in my car and I am going to drive to the store and once I get to the store I am done.

Joanna: Exactly, and that’s not how it works, is it?

Holly: No! but it is so tempting to see personal development and transformational work as a journey that has an end, but it really, for a lot of us, I think it is really not going to end until the day we die, if we are always striving to know ourselves better and create changes.

Joanna: I think so, unless we stop doing the work, right? And I have heard this many times, that the only difference between really super, super, successful people who we would be looking up to right now – and us – who are maybe on the way – is that the super, super, successful people regularly move through their stuff. They identify the next block, or series of blocks, and they do something to release that, or transform that, into something that is more supportive of what they want. So, I guess if we choose to keep moving, we are going to keep doing this until the day we die. I will be tapping on my deathbed! {laughing}

Holly: So, today, what would you say are your favourite tools for transformation?

Joanna: Well, today, it is definitely PSYCH-K® because I just returned from this workshop and I am just so, so, excited.

Both: {laughing}

Joanna: So, I find PSYCH-K® a lot easier than EFT, quicker.

Holly: Oh yeah!

Joanna: Plus, I don’t have to always feel that pesky stuff coming up again.

Holly: Yeah, exactly.

Joanna: I don’t have to let it rise up again, I understand that EFT has its place and recently a mutual friend, Cara Wilde, helped me transform something very, very, deep using EFT and that needed to be willing to feel all the stuff, but that is not necessarily necessary all the time, right?

Holly: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I always say this, I think that everyone has got to find the transformational modality that works for them; because I trained in NLP because that was the first thing that I had ever heard of for transforming stuff like that, but it didn’t resonate with me and I never used it with clients.

Joanna: I’m sorry, but I always, always, forgot that you trained in NLP. Holly is actually going to come and visit me in real life next holiday, so you are going to have to tell me all about NLP, because I don’t really know anything about it.

Holly: Yeah, I am really grateful for having done that training I did it at the same school I trained as a coach, it was great experience, but I never used it with myself or with clients. And so, that just wasn’t my thing, but it was the only thing that I had ever heard of and then as I got more into this really deep transformational journey, I discovered EFT and I liked that, but then I discovered PSYCH-K® and like I always say, my life is before PSYCH-K® and after PSYCH-K®.

Joanna: I haven’t heard you talk about this in any detail and I would really, really, love to hear about why that division of before-PSYCH-K® and after-PSYCH-K®? What do you think was so, so, life-changing about it?

Holly: Because, first of all, it resonated with me, it was easy, and I think the power of having a tool that I could use with myself, whenever I wanted, whenever I needed to, was the big difference. Because, PSYCH-K® – the reason I discovered it – was because a friend of mine from Argentina, who was a psychiatrist, had trained in PSYCH-K® and highly recommended it to me for some stuff that I was working on that wasn’t shifting with anything. So, he said: “Go, see a facilitator, have some sessions, then train in it.” And I had a couple of sessions with a couple of people and it just didn’t resonate with me; and luckily my husband kept pushing me and saying: “Just do the basic workshop, do the basic workshop”, and so I did it. And that was five years ago; and it just completely changed my life, because I was in the same place you are now, I got back home, and I was so excited about it. I had my manual and every day for months after doing the basic workshop, I spent about an hour a day changing beliefs. And I saw big changes, because I was doing a lot of work.

Joanna: Like what? So, I am going to interrupt you, we want to know what those changes were {laughing}?

Holly: Alright, so, at the time I remember I was working with a coach, my business wasn’t a right fit at that time, I was still doing social media stuff. I remember my coach saying between now and the next session I want you to reach out to five people to approach them to ask them to do a JV with you to promote your next upcoming course. And I remember leaving that to the last minute because I was just like: oh my God, I just don’t want to do this. I hate helping people for favours – and of course it is not a favour because they are getting an affiliate money. Oh, it just felt… I just hated it, I didn’t want to do it and I just sat down and I did some belief work on it, identifying all my fears and my blocks and my limiting beliefs and I did a bunch of balances using PSYCH-K® and it was like all of a sudden it was just easy to write the emails, it was easy to take action and that to me is the biggest thing that I have experienced using PSYCH-K®…not only with myself, but it is the biggest change that my clients have seen, that by changing beliefs at the subconscious level it is easier for them to take the actions they need to take to build their business.

Joanna: That’s what I just experienced as well, I have a very similar example, work just became easier. And really, what really struck me about PSYCH-K® and kind of the theory underneath it, underlying it, is the fact that 95% of our actions are controlled by the subconscious, so, by those beliefs. And, I kind of knew this, it was not exactly a new thing, right? But it was the first time I really thought about that, because that just means that whenever you are trying to do something it requires a lot of effort and a lot of willpower. You can still do it, like I have been doing it, right? But it just took me two weeks of procrastinating and kind of going: Ah, I know I want this, why am I not doing it? If you transform the beliefs underneath then the action becomes simpler. Now, it doesn’t mean that your whole life will transform within the next month, right? It just means that you will be able to take the action that you know will move you closer? This is it! This is the basic issue around this which is why people get frustrated, because want that huge transformation in their life, people want the results.

Holly: Yes, that’s the thing, people want big change fast, they want a quick fix, and it is so easy to think that either we are going to go to a PSYCH-K® facilitator or an EFT practitioner, or we are going to train in these techniques ourselves, and it is going to be a quick fix, like all of our problems are going to ‘done’, like you said,within a month… I am just going to use this thing every day for a month and my life is going to be exactly what I want. I mean, at least for me, it hasn’t been reality, I trained in PSYCH-K® 5 years ago and I still use it with myself and I also use the heart-centred-energy work with myself and I have seen massive changes in my life. It is so much easier for me to take action. All the books that I released a couple of years ago, I never would have put those books out if I hadn’t done the belief work to support that, I would have been terrified. I was terrified to write a book and put it on Amazon, but I did it, because I transformed the beliefs. So, it is like I have been able to take these actions that I wanted to take, but it is not like my entire life is…I don’t know…

Joanna: Done! {laughing}

Holly: Yeah exactly. I have arrived!

Joanna: I think that’s really it and we decided to talk about this, because one of the things that I have been thinking about since the PSCYH-K workshops, not very long, but for a couple of days, was that PSYCH-K® and other tools, they promise transformation and they transform all your limiting beliefs and tackle all that stuff, right? So why isn’t every person who knows PSYCH-K® and EFT like super-successful and super-rich. As you said before, why aren’t we swimming in cash? {laughing}

Holly: Well, I think it is a number of things. First of all you have got to do the work, you have got to actually use the technique to change your beliefs and you have got to take the action. And if you want big transformation you have got to take big actions.

Joanna: Yeah, oh gosh, there is so much here to talk about… So you have to do the work, I say this a lot to people who show up to the challenges I run, who read my stuff. At the end of the blog post I will often say: just reading this blog post isn’t going to do anything for you, you have to actually implement this. And do something with it and let it influence your next step. So, just learning EFT and PSCYH-K and knowing they exist isn’t going to do anything. It does take a commitment to do it everyday, I mean that’s impressive what you did Holly.

Holly: I was so impressed with the tool, and once I started seeing results it was so easy to keep together; but one of my messages that I feel that I haven’t been very successful in implanting in people’s minds is, you have got to make this work a habit. You have got to make mindset work a habit, you have got to make transformation work a habit, you have got to make energy work a habit, whatever you call it, you have got to make this stuff a habit where you do it every day, every other day, every week, whatever. So you are constantly identifying what’s blocking you, what’s holding you back, and then transforming the beliefs or the energy around that so that you can take the action to move forward, but it has got to be a habit on a regular basis.

Joanna: Yeah, so that actually brings us to one of the other issues that could explain why not all practitioners of transformational tools are not rich and famous and successful, is the concept of honesty. In order to identify those beliefs, you have to be really willing to be honest with yourself. When I did this with myself this evening, about an offering that I am currently running, that I am starting, it was actually quite confrontational with myself to sit down and be like: okay, I want to do this, there is something off, what is it that I actually believe about this? Because I am the kind of person, I teach stuff that is based in the law of attraction, I want to myself believe that anything is possible. So it is actually quite difficult for me to admit that I actually don’t believe that my success with this offer, with this group, is possible. That was a really hard thing to do and kind of write down.

Holly: That’s the thing, you have got to be willing to do the deep work and the hard work and the challenging work. You have got to be willing to dig deep and look at your mind crap and recognise what your fears are and write them down on a piece of paper so that you can see them and work with them. And I think a lot of people aren’t willing to go that deep.

Joanna: I think that’s a really, really, important point. And now I know that certainly when I started doing EFT all those years ago, I was not willing to go deep. I was just using other people’s scripts. Like EFT works on that you are supposed to feel the thing that you are clearing as you are clearing it, so that it is disassociated… and I was very, very, on the surface with all that. So, actually, I was doing it and I thought just by doing it that something would change, something would transform, but I wasn’t going deep enough and that is sometimes difficult to do, it is scary to go in there.

Holly: It is, it is, and I think that it is important to realise that the more you do this the more results you are going to get. I often have clients that will, and I have been tightening my boundaries on this, but I have in the past had clients who stretched out the time between sessions, because they will say: I don’t really have anything to work on. And I am thinking in my mind, I know that’s absolute bullshit, because if I had stuff to work on for an hour a day every single day you can come up with something between now and next week. You could come up with a lot of things if you are willing to go there. And those are the people who I want to work with are the people who are willing to dig deep and get rid of that crap.

Joanna: It does take a certain commitment to your goal, you have to really want it. Because just kind of jumping on the entrepreneurship train it is not going to do it, you actually have to really, really, want it, to dig up some of that stuff. And yes I think that is a reason why not all practitioners/facilitators are super-successful, is that honesty bit of doing it with themselves. I think probably a lot of them are great at facilitating other people’s transformation, but doing it for yourself is a lot harder and of course there will always be things that you will need somebody else for, right?

Holly: And I always say that, I always say: I always work with myself but I also always have someone else that I work with, because I am in my head all day, every day, so there are things I cannot access because I have grown comfortable with it, it is normal to me. So, I need someone else to dig deep in my head and pick stuff out.

Joanna: This is going to be a fun holiday we are doing together. We are just going to sit in my house and do PSYCH-K® on each other, I can already see it! {laughing}

Holly: {laughing} And just pick the crap out of each other’s minds and clear it. {laughing}

Joanna: Well, to each their own, if this is our idea of fun! {laughing}

Holly: {laughing} Okay, so my question is: what about people who appear to be non-spiritual people, who are clearly successful, how did they get there? Did they just not need this stuff? Does not everyone need to do this stuff? How does that happen?

Joanna: The word that is coming to me right now, or the idea, you asked me that question before we stated and I had no idea. But I think the answer to that is that they do it through had work and hustle.

Holly: Yes, I agree, I agree. So, you can either do it the hard way and just hustle, hustle, hustle and feel the fear and do it anyway; or you can do it the softer way, which is clearing the stuff so that you can take action more easily.

Joanna: And with PSYCH-K® it is not just clearing the stuff, it is actually imprinting beliefs that are supportive, so it is not just clearing the old ones. That’s what is great about it I think, you are not just clearing, you are actually putting in beliefs that are more supportive, so the action becomes easier. So my example for this is not actually business-related but weight-loss related. So, I have been trying to lose weight for so many years and it is just all willpower, and so it doesn’t work because come evening my willpower has kind of…and it just doesn’t work. But I don’t have any results to report yet, but I was hoping that PSYCH-K® would be the answer to that, for me, because if I am kind of always trying to eat well and exercise and whatever but my underlying belief is, which I think is the case but I haven’t tested, is that: It won’t work for me anyway or it is too late because I am too old, then it is not going to do anything, right? Because I am self-sabotaging because I want my reality to match my beliefs.

Holly: Right.

Joanna: And I think that if I had super willpower and I really made myself, I could do it without the belief work. So, it is not that it’s impossible, it is just harder.

Holly: Right. But I think it is harder for us because we are the kind of people who want personal transformation to make things easier, but I think perhaps there is no right way. For some people the hustle and the hard work, that’s their right way, because they like that. And for other people, like us, we don’t want the hard work, we want the ease and the transformation. What do you think?

Joanna: I don’t know, I wonder if people really, really, like to work hard or if that’s just an escape from something else?

Holly: Or if that’s just all they know and they don’t know that there is an easier way.

Joanna: Or they don’t believe there is an easier way. I wonder. I mean there are people who love to work, but always at the expense of something else, so it doesn’t seem like that happiness is true, gained in that way. So, I do think that if more people committed to using such tools, things would be just easier for them. It doesn’t mean that everyone would experience miracles all the time.

Holly: Right.

Joanna: I think it is not just about the effort, or the willpower, that has to be sustained over a period of time, it is like: today you have to say: oh I’m not going to eat those cookies and then tomorrow you have to do the same thing.

Holly: Yeah. It is consistency.

Joanna: And effort is just the same, unless I quit all sugar and stop having cravings. But that’s an extreme example. For normal, average, behaviour you have to have that willpower every single day and that’s hard.

Holly: I think that is tiring.

Joanna: It is tiring and I guess it, I am sure it is the same for business, or for building a sort of dream, or whatever. If you think your business, if you think your work is not valuable, it is really hard to get up every day and try to sell people stuff.

Holly: Exactly, exactly. And that’s one of the big things that a lot of people don’t value their knowledge, they don’t value what they bring to their business. And so, if your sense of self worth is really low, it is going to be really hard to charge for your services, to charge the right price for your services, and to make money for your business. There are so many aspects of business and underlying beliefs that are completely support you, or keep you stuck.

Joanna: I just remembered that you muscle-test for the perfect price for your offer. That’s a cool way of using it. Another really nice thing about PSYCH-K® specifically that EFT doesn’t have, I don’t think, is the muscle testing, because you know when it is done.

Holly: Yeah exactly.

Joanna: I really like that, it feels like some kind of confirmation, because once you change your belief you never have to redo that particular belief again, it is like there is an assurance you know? Like it tested strong, okay, so that’s one done, I don’t have to worry about that anymore.

Holly: Exactly.

Joanna: And there is something to that, because when I did them around my program a couple of days later I went back into the pattern of ‘oh, I don’t know…’ And my brain said: you’ve already done that. That one’s done, that’s the old pattern.

Holly: Stop worrying about that.

Joanna: Yeah and I thought that was really interesting. The question was why aren’t all these facilitators super successful? They don’t do the work, not everybody does the work, not everybody is willing to be honest and dig stuff up.

Holly: Yea, and not everybody takes the action.

Joanna: Not everybody takes the action. And then the successful people who don’t use these tools, they can be successful but I guess it is through hustle and hard work. That also seems too simplistic Holly though, there must be successful people who just were lucky?

Holly: Oh yes, I’m sure, yeah they knew the right people, they had good contacts, it all just fell into place because they had the support network that they needed.

Joanna: And we don’t all have the same limiting beliefs of course.

Holly: Exactly, exactly. Some of us come into this world with less mind crap than others. {laughing}

Joanna: Or we learn it in our childhood, I don’t know how much mind crap we come in with. But like those first seven years of life, when you are a sponge for everything, everybody makes different decisions, right?

Holly: I particularly came to this new business that I have now with a lot of limiting beliefs and fears and blocks that I gained during my first business that I ran for 10 ten years… I had so many unsupportive beliefs there. I feel like the first couple of years that I was doing PSYCH-K® with myself I was clearing stuff that I had, and I am still clearing stuff, that I am uncovering from the ten years that I ran my first business, so…

Joanna: Yeah, they get stuck in there.

Holly: Yeah, they do, they do.

Joanna: So, what’s your opinion about how often… Once you choose a transformational tool, I think we are going to agree that even though these transformational tools might not offer a result, like a big result, right away, they do offer enough transformation that it is worth using, right?

Holly: Exactly. Yeah. Without a doubt I can say that the time that I have invested in doing this work with myself has more than paid off in the results, the return on investment in terms of time and gains are incredible.

Joanna: Right, so what’s your opinion about how often one should use these tools, whatever tool you choose, and is there a thing as too much?

Holly: Oh, that’s very interesting. Yeah, how often are you supposed to use it? Well, I think it depends, because like I said in the beginning I was using it every day for about an hour, and that’s because had a lot of stuff to clear, I was really excited about the technique and I was seeing the results. After several months, I probably tapered down to maybe doing it once a week, and now I would say I do it probably about once a week every other week, it depends. I kind of go through phases. I will go through a phase where one week I will do three or four days of work and then the next couple of weeks I won’t do anything. So, it kind of goes in ebbs and flows, and it is almost like, I do a lot of work, and then I kind of take a lot of action, and then that triggers more stuff so then I do a lot of work and then I take a lot of action. So, you have got to have that balance between the transformational work and the action and to respond to your question: can you do too much? This is a whole different… Did you want to respond to what I just said before I go into that because I think that is a whole different topic.

Joanna: Yeah because you said that there needs to be a balance between the transformational work and the action and I think, aside from the fact that it is the action that will actually create stuff, that is also because it is only in the action that you will see the results.

Holly: Exactly, you can’t just…

Joanna: Otherwise you don’t know if it is working.

Holly: Exactly, you can’t just do this work and then sit back and be like: universe bring it all to me.

Joanna: {joking} Why not Holly! Why not?

Holly: You can, but I don’t know if that is going to get you anything. {laughing} Give it a try. Yes, you have to take the action if you want to get the results in your business. You can’t just sit back and hope the clients are going to pore through your door, stampede…

Joanna: I keep hoping. If anything is possible, that too should be possible.

Holly: True, you are right, anything is possible, but do you believe that’s possible? That’s the thing.

Joanna: I think you need to take the action that you believe will get you there, right? I think that’s what it is about, because I actually do have a belief, maybe I should experiment on myself, but I do have a belief that if I want to fill my group program I am going to have to have some kind of invitation or sales page, and I am going to have to tell people about it. Now, maybe that’s kind of an obvious thing, I wonder what would happen if I instilled a belief that I don’t have to do that stuff, right? I wonder… I might conduct an experiment.

Holly: Right. So think about how you would like people to sign up for this program, what would be your absolute ideal? And what do you need to believe to make that happen?

Joanna: So anything is possible but you kind of need to kind of get clear on the details then.

Holly: Yeah, and you do not need to do something, because if you don’t tell anybody about it, obviously no one is going to signup for it, because that’s the reality, because someone needs to know about it.

Joanna: Yeah so interesting. Right, so, is there such a thing as too much transformational work?

Holly: Yeah, so, I think there can be, there are two ways that there is too much transformational work, so you can do too much transformational work and just do only transformational work and not take the action, which we have just talked about – you need the balance of both things. And I think you can get to the point where you can get a little burnt out, or tired, from doing too much transformational work; so you really need to be aware of how your energy levels are, how you are feeling, how you are responding, because sometimes when you do a lot of work it can effect you, it can make you tired, maybe you need more sleep to process the stuff. So, you need to be very, very, aware of what your body needs and what your system needs as you are doing this work so you can support yourself in other ways. So, it is not so much just doing too much work, but ensuring that you don’t get burnt out from the results of doing that work because so much is changing and your mind needs time to catch up.

Joanna: You need to integrate as well, don’t you? You need to have a rest between big spiritual and mindset transformation, so that it can integrate. Yeah, I’m trying to think is there a thing that is too much? I think we can get caught up. It is a lot easier to sit here and like EFT it, than it is to get out there and do live streams and kind of tell people how great I am at what I do. I think a lot of people get stuck in using transformational work, or the need to clear more stuff, as an excuse to not get out there and talk to people. It doesn’t have to be huge things, but just to talk to people.

Holly: And that’s why I think you always need to pare the transformational work with the action, even if it is just a little bit of transformational work and a little bit of action, but always have that action there. Otherwise you get so caught up in changing beliefs and doing the stuff that you think: Ah I’ve done all my work for the day. And it’s like: yeah you have done your inner work for the day, but you still need to do the outer work for the day.

Joanna: Yeah. That just reminded me, isn’t there a song like that? I’m sure those aren’t the exact words, but: a little more transformation a little more action.

Both: laughing

Holly: Maybe we need to write the song, maybe that’s our next podcast.

Joanna: No, no, no it’s: a little less conversation, a little more action. I can’t remember what the song was, but it does exist… Yeah, so, my way of doing it is: I have a commitment to both mindset and belief changing, or whatever, but mostly in the context of staying high vibration. That’s my big thing, and I have a half-hour slot in my calendar every day for that, and I use that slot for whatever I want to do, sometimes it is actual work, EFT work, if I am struggling with something – or now it will be PSYCH-K stuff – or, just reading a book that uplifts me, or whatever. But I have that slot, and a lot of people are scared to put in that consistent slot. I have left it open every day, it is not like I know what I will be doing, because like today I didn’t do it because I had a call at that time in the morning and the day is flying by and I didn’t do it. Is that the end of the world, no?

Holly: No! Because if you are being consistent, if you have don’t it six days out of the week and you missed one day, that’s not a big deal. But if you are doing it once a month, once every three months, that’s when you are like: what results are you expecting from this if you are not going to commit to doing it more frequently?

Joanna: So the answer is to commit to doing it regularly, but make sure that you don’t kind of start doing it as an excuse because it can be a lot more fun, that’s a a silly thing to say, it can be more safe.

Holly: Yeah, because you are doing it with yourself alone In your room, office, whatever, rather than putting yourself out there and getting visible with what you do.

Joanna: I have a strong belief that you do need to be visible with what you do in order to get known, right? To get known, you need people to actually know you! {laughing}

Holly: {laughing} funny how that works!

Joanna: Is transformation actually possible Holly?

Holly: I think it is but I am not sure…we talked about the quick fix earlier, I think big transformation is possible, but perhaps not in the way that we think it is going to happen. I think a lot of us expect miracles and I am not going to say they don’t happen, but I don’t think they always happen. I think a lot of times the changes are subtle and it’s a journey.

Joanna: Yeah, I guess it is the expectation, right? We were saying earlier that both the founders of EFT PSYCH-K they say that you can use their tools to clear these limiting beliefs, or to transform beliefs, they don’t say everybody is going to be perfectly healthy and rich. And yet, we have kind of misappropriated those tools, and the word ‘transformation’, to mean some kind of quick huge change in life. But then, Holly, if that’s the case, and if transformation actually happens in small steps, is it still true that the success that we want, the big success for those of us who want big success, is it actually possible?

Holly: I think it is, but I think big success, or big transformation, also requires deep mindset work and big actions. So it is how deep and dark are you willing to go, and how big are the actions that you are willing to take?

Joanna: Yeah, you are probably right. Sometimes – and this conversation is going so kind of smoothly that I sometimes forget that it is being recorded for other people to listen to, but I will say this anyway, even though I have remembered {Both: laughing} – sometimes I have moments where I think: what if I spend my whole life EFT-ing and PSYCH-K-ing and everything else and nothing really changes that much. That thought really scares me. I do believe that success is possible and I do believe that miracles are possible, but sometimes I wonder with these kind of small transformations not everybody is going to have success. Or the big success they want.

Holly: Yeah, but it also depends on how you define success. That’s going to be different for everyone. I know what you mean and when I look back and I think I have dedicated my life to making this work a habit with myself for the last five years. Am I rich and famous? No. But I have written and self-published seven books, I have got more in the pipeline. I don’t think if you asked me five years ago I remember I wanted to write a book five years ago, I wanted to write a book years ago, but did I believe that it was possible, did I think I was going to do it? I don’t think so. So I have done things that are much bigger than I thought I was capable of doing.

Joanna: Yeah, and I think that’s an important thing to bear in mind, for anybody listening, if you think to where you were five years ago. My husband has to remind me of this all the time, because I always forget, I am always like: ‘It is not going fast enough’. He is like: Well think back to five years ago, where were you? For me, it was really the start of the journey, I had no idea what any of the stuff. I was really just starting to learn about myself and business… everything. It was really just the beginning. And I also have achieved and accomplished lots of things in that time, so it does create changes, yeah it is just something to consider. And I think you are right that if we commit to it, to both the inner work and the big action, then the sky is the limit, right?

Holly: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Joanna: So, another topic for another time, Holly, that is coming up from this is money specifically, we should talk about that sometime; because that is a really tricky one, because sometimes it doesn’t matter how many balances and clearings and whatever else you do, around the subject of money, it doesn’t really shift all that much. And why is that?

Holly: Or, the money comes in but not perhaps from the channels you want it to come through.

Joanna: So that’s another topic, I think we should definitely do that next time?

Holly: It is, but it reminded me of something that I meant to say earlier, which is: sometimes we have this clear vision of what we think we want in our lives, but the universe has another idea of where we should be headed, or where we are headed or what our life path is. And sometimes we can’t see that because we have got the limiting beliefs, and the more we clear the stuff, the more we fine tune our paths and get to different places than we would have gotten without doing that work.

Joanna: Definitely, definitely opportunities open up, don’t they? Once you clear away the: I am not good enough(s), and the I am not worthy, all that kind of thing.

Holly: And I feel that the more I have done this work, and the more I have cleared the blocks and I have programmed new beliefs that support me, the better I know myself. It is easier for me to make decisions, it is easier for me to trust myself, it is easier for me to just do stuff in life and in business, because I have got more of the beliefs that support me and less of the beliefs that don’t support me.

Joanna: I totally agree. So our original question, Holly…what was the original question?! It was: are transformational tools really transformation?

Holly: Yes, for me the answer is yes. Without doubt yes.

Joanna: For me as well, I really did want to explore this difference between small changes and huge miracles, and whether we can still be satisfied with the small transformations, keeping in mind the possibility that life may not work out the way we currently want it to. And we never want to be thinking: oh that was a waste of time!

Holly: Yeah, exactly. I would never ever consider any of the times that I have spent doing this work with myself to be a waste, it has always produced something. And another thing I think we need to say is that you don’t always see the results right away, it is not like you spend an hour of doing mindset work with yourself and then tomorrow it is like: boom amazing stuff happens. It might take a few weeks, it might take a few months, because that’s how life works. You need to take the actions, and those actions lead to stuff happening, but it is not always like 24-hour turnaround.

Joanna: Yes, I think that the results are possible to get you are right, but it is the action piece that is really, really, important. The transformational tools are just part of a puzzle. They are part of a bunch of other stuff that you need to do that includes action, that includes other things like self-care, right? There are other things I think that are part of that puzzle of success that are needed.

Holly: So, I think it is definitely possible, we need to manage our expectations of results and what’s possible.

Joanna: And we need to actually need to use the tools and take the action.

Holly: Good, well, thank you for having this conversation with me!

Joanna: Thank you, I always love talking to you Holly!

Holly: And I hope everyone has found this useful, if anyone listening has any questions about this topic, about this episode, about us and the way that we work with people you can email me at: [email protected] or Joanna…

Joanna: [email protected]

Holly: Right. And if you have any questions again, get in touch, let us know what you thought of this and tune in for next time when we will be talking about money.

Joanna: Bye!

Holly: Thank you for listening, I hope you enjoyed this episode, please drop me a line and let me know what you thought of it. You can email me at: [email protected] or you can find me on Facebook, Twitter or Instagram and get in touch. I would love to share your comments and give you a shout out on the show if you like. I would also love for you to join me in my private Facebook group: Business Mindset Alchemists, so we can continue the conversation there. Podcasting is such a one-way conversation, as much as I love it, so I really enjoy getting feedback from people in the group. And that could be comments on this episode, or other episodes, ideas of topics and things that you would like me to talk about, whatever let’s talk mindset, let’s talk about this show. So, if you head over to https://www.hollyworton.com/group you will be redirected to the Facebook group. And finally, whether you have been listening to this show for a while, or if you have just heard your first episode, if you are drawn to learning more about mindset work, and you would like to learn more about how you can work with me, please get in touch or head over to https://www.hollyworton.com/call and you can book in a call with me to learn more. I would love to work with you and help you transform your mindset. This is such powerful work I hope this episode gave you an idea of just ow amazing it is. It has been life-changing for me so I would love to share that. And finally, thank you so much for listening (I keep saying finally and then I keep talking!) thank you so much for listening, this is the most important part because if it wasn’t for you this podcast wouldn’t exist, I wouldn’t just talk to silence or talk to no one. So, thank you for listening and if you enjoyed this episode please leave a quick review on iTunes, it would mean the world to me and remember to visit hollyworton.com/244 for the show notes on this episode.

Next week’s episode is a solo show where I talk about how to spring clean your business and why you might want to do that. We recently had the spring equinox and that inspired me to talk a little bit about the importance of paying attention to where we are in the year and taking actions that coincide with the energies that are going on in different parts of the year. So, I hope you find it interesting and useful. Thanks again and have a great day.

244: Joanna Hennon + Holly: Can You Expect Miracles From Doing Transformation Work?