BMP201 Holly Worton & 4 “Woo” Experts: How to Get Over Your Fear of Sharing Your Woo

The Why

The Definition

Listen to this episode

  

What You’ll Learn

• Top tips from four experts on how you can be more open about your woo side
• How they overcame their fear of being judged for their woo
• How their businesses changed when they started to be more open about their woo
• Why some of the experts really don’t like the word “woo”
• How to introduce your woo side to people
• How to know when to share and when not to
• Why being open can make your business more fun
• Why the world needs more stuff like this
• How to help others feel comfortable with the woo stuff
• How to own it as part of who you are
• Why the judgment is all about other people’s fears
• How to know when you’re at the point of no return in sharing your woo
• Baby steps you can take to get more comfortable in sharing
• Where to start talking about it first
• Why introducing your woo is like practicing your elevator pitch

Thing We Discussed

• It’s Not Woo. It’s Real. By Cara Wilde
• How I came out of the channeling closet. By Joanna Hennon 

Connect With Holly

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Related episodes

• 296 Joanna Hennon + Holly: Talking to Unseen Beings: Is it Enlightened, or Just Crazy?
• 292 Joanna Hennon + Holly ~ What’s Better: Spirit Guides or Tapping into Your Intuition? Part II
• 290: Jo Casey + Holly ~ What’s Better: Spirit Guides or Tapping into Your Intuition?
• 281: Jo Casey + Holly ~ Woo & You
• BMP202 Holly Worton ~ Messages from the Heart-centered Energy Work Guides on Business & Life

Transcript

The transcript for this episode can also be downloaded here (no opt-in required). 

Transcript

Holly:   Hello and welcome to the Business Mindset Podcast, episode 201. This is your host Holly Worton and I am here with a special extended episode. So, I have got, not just one, but four guests today, for a mini-interview, where we are going to be talking about how to bring the woo into your business. And this episode came about, because every once in a while, I asked the women in my Business Mindset Alchemists private Facebook group, which you can find at: hollyworton.com/group what they would like me to talk about on the show. And the topic of woo came up. So, they wanted to know: how to get over your fear of sharing your woo; and because this is something that I have personally struggled with, and I know it is something other people struggle with, I thought it was worth really delving deep into this topic and making, kind of, a big deal out of it. Because, I am going to be honest, I am still not 100% open about my woo – which you mind find surprising. I actually, was recently speaking to a friend, and she said that she used to love this podcast, until it kind of started getting a little bit more woo and then she stopped listening. So, if you have been following me for any amount of time you have probably been seeing it come out little by little. I have been taking baby steps to kind of get there and get open about it, but, I am still not at 100%.

            So, as you can tell, I knew this wasn’t a topic that I could consider myself to be an expert on, so I contacted four of my online business friends, whom I considered to be experts on the topic, and people who are super-confident and comfortable talking about this stuff and I asked them about their experiences. So, I asked them for their top tips in how people can get over their fear of sharing their woo – so people can be 100% authentic, or more authentic, and aligned and open online, if that’s what they want – because that’s kind of the buzz-word these days: you have got to be authentic; and that makes sense, because the more authentic we are the more show of ourselves, the more we will attract the right clients to us and our business. So, I got together this small group of four woo experts, people who I consider to be open about their woo, and we got together and recorded these mini-interviews on the topic. Now this extended episode has taken a couple of months to pull together, I first started talking about this back in February, so I am super-excited that it is finally ready for your ears.

            So, before we get into it, I just wanted to talk a little bit about woo. It is a heavy word and as you will hear in this episode some of the experts don’t like the word at all – and it is not surprising why – because while I like the word because I love woo stuff, and I see it as the secret sauce to kind of many of the women that I enjoy working with, the official definitions are pretty derogatory. So, Marianne Webster, defines ‘woo woo’ as something that is: ‘dubiously or outlandishly mystical, supernatural or unscientific’. Dictionary.com defines it as: ‘being based or involving irrational superstition’. And the origin of the world is not certain, but people think it is based on that [making woo noise], kind of weird background sound and science-fiction or weird kinds of films.   So, yeah, it is not a super-positive word. And, so, it is easy to see why so many people feel really uncomfortable with sharing their woo side. But, as one of our guests Lisa Wechtenhiser says on the show, everybody has it to one degree or another, and it is true, it is just a matter of how much you integrate that into your life and your business.

So, without further ado, let’s get into this episode. We are going to start out with our first guest, Cara Wilde, who helps people who are called to co-create a heaven on earth. She helps people to channel their guide, to achieve their soul’s goals in this lifetime, and to live their most joy-fuelled life. She was previously a guest on this show in episodes: 13, back in the first year, and 116, more recently. 

Holly:   Hi Cara!

Cara:   Hi!

Holly:   So, we are talking about woo today.

Cara:   We are.

Holly:   Yes. So, would you say that you are 100% open about your woo, in your business marketing and communications and in your online relationships and stuff?

Cara:   I was thinking about this…I am the woo in my business [laughing]. It is like: I don’t think you could get much more woo in my head; so yeah, obviously, one of the main components of my business is that I verbally challenge my guides. So, I allow a non-physical being to talk through me. [laughing] So, yeah. My business kind of built around that, so, before that I only did EFT and just did guides-work in the kind of background with small groups. And, so, when I came online, I had not come across the term woo before, I was like: ‘what’s that?’.

Holly:   [Laughing] That’s just normal!

Cara:   Yeah, what is that! And, so, I think that probably made a big difference, because, I had been working offline, and when I had been working in mainstream counselling, I was very open with my woo then, and I have just been open all my life really, as soon as it found me. So yeah, 100% woo. was very o woo then. I j

cause, I had been working offline and when I had been working in mainstream counselling , I was very o

Holly:   And have you always felt safe and comfortable sharing that with other people – because I think so many people struggle with sharing that part of themselves. And yet for you it seems really natural?

Cara:   Do you know: it is the term ‘woo’ that I think can throw us. So, I found it when I was 17, and I was just really excited, and so I would talk to anybody who would stop and listen to me really about it; I must have drove people crazy! But people were generally curious, but I think that’s the key thing, for people that are already aware, and in that online business, and then it turned woo as though it is something weird and strange. And people almost say it apologetically you know: ‘it’s a bit woo’ and I wrote this blog post: it’s not woo it is real’. And I think that if I was going to say anything to anybody who is in that place where they know it’s woo but they have discovered it for themselves, that try and think of as different, it is natural, it is just not usual, you know, and just don’t think of it… I wouldn’t even call it woo.

Holly:   What would call it? Or would you just not give it a name?

Cara:   No, just this, I don’t think I would call it…it is just these experiences I am having, you know. I mean, I think we have all got our own areas of vulnerability, so my area of vulnerability around it is not business online. My area of vulnerability can be business groups that are set up for serious business; and I thinking ‘oh god, are they going to think, because of what I do, that I am not capable’, but that’s my own judgements, that’s not been my experience. And my other area of vulnerability was when my kids went to school, mainstream school, and we live in a small village, everybody knows everybody and I had not been here long and I am just like: ‘oh God’ because I didn’t know how it would affect the kids. So, the other piece of advice I have got is: be discerning. Like, tell it in dribs and drabs, and test it out a bit. But, my experience, even with the teachers, they were all like: ‘whoa that’s awesome! and do you know, my aunty thinks she once saw a ghost’. And everybody has got a story, because people are fascinated. People are fascinated.

Holly:   I think, you are the second person who has told me that, so I think that’s something that is really important for listeners to take away is: people are more curious and interested – and as you say, fascinated – than we might think. So, what would you recommend that people do to let go their fears of judgement about this.

Cara:   Well, I mean it depends what business you are in, the using discernment, it would be to introduce it with the excitement that you actually feel and, you know, if you are still a bit wobbly about it, or not sure about it yourself, or how it is going to show up in your business, then is it the right time to share it? Like, it is okay to not share what’s going off if it doesn’t affect your business, but if you are going to… like really own it if you are going to share it: ‘this amazing thing just started happening and I don’t really know what it is’, and just ease it in, just gently. Does that make sense?

Holly:   Um hmm yeah – and I feel like sharing this part of our lives, is part of being open and vulnerable online, and also really stepping up in who we are, in all facets of who we are. And do you ever feel like: if you were to hold, obviously this is your business, but if you were to hold kind of all the stories you share about this part of your life, if you hold that back, how would that effect you online – do you feel like it would make you be less you?

Cara:   Well that’s the other thing, authenticity and relationship-building is such a key component to businesses now, that’s what makes the difference; and people are more interested with connecting with people because of what they see in you that they want for themselves. You know, we all project our… what I call our light shadow onto people, and we want to connect with that, because what we really wanting to do is connect with that part of ourselves. So, people can tell, you know, people can really tell and I think that people are what I call ‘reading the energy’, and your business is more fun, when you do it like that as well. You know, I have really just brought into my business an element of play, which is a core strength for me, but I have a fear that I am not going to be taken seriously. So, my fear is not the woo it is other things – we all have our places, but I am getting really good feedback, because I am engaging, I am being me, and work flows easily (well, more easily you know), and it feels a bit magical when you play to your core strengths I think.

Holly:   And how do you feel like being really-transparent about the channeling and the things that you do in your business that aren’t particularly mainstream, how do you feel that helped you to be more successful and more authentic?

Cara:   That’s interesting, because like I said, my business kind of built up around the fact that I could channel, and people were asking me to do it anyway; but it has helped my business, in that the people who want to be able to do it for themselves and want to know about it are interested even more, so it has opened up new products and services, it has opened up new pipelines of connection, and, yeah..

Holly:   Good. So, do you have any last tips for someone who is maybe feeling a bit wobbly, but they do want to step up and share more about this side of themselves?

Cara:   Well, I think the…one of the big things that helps in business is when we take the focus off of us and we put the focus back on either service, or the mission, or what’s known as the results we offer. So, in terms of like blending the woo, the service that you are offering is… because the world needs more stuff like this – you know, we need more magic, we need a different way, old things aren’t working anymore…so, you are part of this kind of evolution where this way of working, this way of communicating, and connecting, is part of the future, so get on that ride, it’s awesome, it’s exciting. So, be excited about it, rather than embarrassed about it, learn how to embrace that part of yourself within yourself. Does that make sense?

Holly:   Yeah, that makes absolute sense.

Cara:   So, that you feel more comfortable.

Holly:   Yeah.

Cara:   And then what other people think will bounce off you more often, more easily and you will find people that really want to engage with you, and engage with you and your business in ways that you might not be able to think are possible right now too. So, it could lead to all sorts of things.

Holly:   Excellent. Well thank you so much for your tips – and I think your experience is really important, because you have made this such a fundamental part of your business – so thank you!

Cara:   You are welcome.

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Holly:   Our next guest is my business coach and mentor, Lisa Wechtenhiser. Lisa is a challenge for guides and teachers in spirit. She calls herself the ‘trust whisperer’ because she helps people to develop unwavering trust in themselves, and Lisa was previously a guest on episode 88.

            Now, I wanted to have Lisa on this show because I think she is such a great example of how she makes the woo practical. And, so, we are going to talk a little bit more about this in just a second.

Holly:   Hey Lisa, how are you?

Lisa:    Hey Holly, I am awesome. Good to be with you.

Holly:   Good to be with you, let’s talk woo.

Lisa:    Yeah.

Holly:   So, would you say that you’re a 100% open about your woo in your business marketing and communications?

Lisa:    I would say – yes, I am, yeah.

Holly:   And I love that, because when I first met you, you used to call yourself, and you used to say that you were practically woo, because you bring the woo and the practical business stuff together.

Lisa:    Yeah, that’s right.

Holly:   So, I would say that that was pretty-clear, in your marketing and business message.

Lisa:    Yeah, I um, because I started offering intuitive readings, and so that’s of its very nature woo. [Holly: laughing] So, it was hard to not… But my way of doing it was to bring down the information in a very practical, and useful way, for people. So, that was the difference, for me that was the difference.

Holly:   Yeah, and I think one of the interesting things about you, and what I have always sensed, is that you are a very practical person; you are not like off in the clouds like doing woo stuff. I don’t know you manage to take that guidance, and that information, and that wisdom and bring it into something practical and actionable, and useful.

Lisa:    Yeah, and I was not always that way. That really came about because I had early on, I had prepared like a 20-page-reading for one of my friends, with all of her guides stepped forward and spoke about different things, and, it was this huge reading and I was so proud of it and I gave it to her and she came back and said ‘this is lovely, thank you so much. And what am I supposed to do with this?’ [Holly: laughing] And I was like: ‘yeah, what are you supposed to do with this?’

Holly:   But you have 20 pages of information!

Lisa:    Right. So, that’s actually where ‘practically intuitive’ was born, because I thought: ‘well you can’t just tell people your aura is pink and there is love all around you’ as… ‘how does that impact me in my life?’ So, that’s really where I thought: ‘okay there needs to be another piece to this, and then I started bringing it down.’ So that was my agreement when I work with, and still is, with spirit guides, is that any information that they give me for my client has to be something that we can bring down into real-life action so that they can see how things change by doing that, and they do.

Holly:   I love that; so that starts with setting the intention for the type of information that you are going to receive.

Lisa:    Yeah. Absolutely.

Holly:   Good. I love that. So, did you ever have any fears about people judging you for your woo, and if so how did you get over that?

Lisa:    Initially I did and it had a lot to do with one person, and my cousin, who is very, very, Catholic, and she got scared when I first started doing this, and I think she thought that I was going off to the ‘dark side’. And that hurt my feelings, because I am like: ‘I am here, walking in love and light, and you think I am doing this thing’ and it said to me like: ‘I have to be able to be who I am and if she chooses to go away, okay, I will miss her, I love her’ and you know what she didn’t? And she is like one of my biggest fans now. So, initially, I was afraid of other people’s judgements, but once I learned that is really about their fears, and not even about me or my path, or any of that, then it helped me kind of you know, be more aware of what’s going on with them, and not to take it so personally.

Holly:   Mm and I think that one of the things that you said to me on more than one occasion, was that when you started being really open about your woo, people started asking you about it, they were really curious about it.

Lisa:    Yeah – I worked for a time in a financial services firm and I was very open: ‘I talk to dead people, I can do this thing and I can talk to your spirit guides’, and you know that’s not a place generally, where that happens, but I am pretty normal… [laughing] I would say, in most respects. And, so, they didn’t feel any fear. And, in fact, we used to laugh, because I have two windows around the area where I work, and if people came to one window it was business-related and if people came to the other window; they needed woo or counselling, or some other thing that they knew I could have. And they were always like walking by me going: ‘do you hear my brothers, my aunt hanging around, or what’s the message for today?’ So, I felt like, just by presenting myself as: ‘yeah, it’s this thing I do’ – you know I could bake great chocolate cakes, and I talk to dead people’. [Holly: laughing] You know it was no big deal. That’s when meant they felt comfortable, because they felt comfortable with me and I think that’s really probably the key. If you are not talking round: ‘I talk to dead people’ [in spooky voice] kind of thing but just be you and ‘yeah, I can do this thing’ and then it puts other people’s minds at ease, I find.

Holly:   Mm now how long have you had this awareness that you could talk to dead people and spirit guides?

Lisa:    I knew I was highly intuitive all my life, because my mum was, and I saw her put it into action, but it really wasn’t until after my goddaughter died in 2006, that she was the first person I heard from the other side. And that, you know, and even my mum – my mum died later that year, it was a tough year – but the last thing I said to my mum was: ‘you know I can hear you wherever you go, so you go and just say hi now and again’. And so it really became very, very, clear to me, that not only do I hear dead people, but spirit guides; but I can hear on a different plane than a lot of people are aware of.

Holly:   Mm okay; so what would you say are your top tips with people who want to be more open about woo, they want to bring it into their business, they want to be able to just talk about it like it is something normal, but they are really afraid?

Lisa:    I would say the first thing is: you have to own it and one of my clients – I love her so much – she is a wizard and so her guides told her to go buy a wizard hat [HW: laughing], and to wear the wizard hat around the house. And she did! And we talked last week and she said: ‘I think my housekeeper saw me walk by in my wizard hat’ and that was like… how hilarious is that! But that’s her owning it to herself, right? And learning to be comfortable in that energy before you can announce it to the world, you have to own it – otherwise, it doesn’t have any kind of depth to it.

            So, the first piece I would say is like really own it, it is part of who you are and truthfully it is part of everyone, but like some people come into this lifetime you know as piano virtuosos at 5, and some of us just continue plunking away at 55 or whatever, right? Some of us have that heightened ability, but all of us have the ability.

That’s the number 2 piece I would say – you know, it’s not weird to have it, everybody has it to one degree or another; so, you know, what degree are you willing to open up to.

The third thing is: you know we can use a lot of different language, you know, people get when you say: ‘the gut feeling’, well, that’s your damn intuition. Hello! Right? But that’s something that everybody understands, and it is not like ‘ooh she is off on another planet’ kind of thing. So, you know, use the language-ing that might fit the situation, right? I am not going to walk into a room of doctors and say: ‘my spirit guides told me that da.da.da.da is going on’ but I would say: ‘my gut feeling about what’s going to happen is this’. Right? And, so. it is just the language, it is in the language-ing, but you have to own it for what’s right.

The next piece I would say is: don’t be afraid of judgement – and that’s so easy to say I get that – and yet like I said earlier that judgement is all about that person and their fears. When I first started channeling Prince last year or you know, when I was aware of that, that became my channel Prince and his ascended master status, I was terrified to tell people about that, because I was like ‘oh my god they are going to think I am using his name to make money, I am going to get judged’. And I did get judged. I heard people say: ‘you should be in a medical institution’ and blah de blah. I don’t care, you know what I don’t care! This is my work, I know this is my work, and I am just going to go ahead and do that. Was I scared? Yes, I really was. And here’s the thing, and this is the piece that I think you kind of have to have in order to really put it out there big: you have to know that you can’t not do this. And that’s the way I was with the Prince thing, you know I mean I had a choice, did I want to go further than ‘yeah he talks to me yeah whatever’ right? Did I want to do that and address that judgement, or do I just want to go back to whatever it was that I was doing prior to that? And when I really look at that I was like: ‘I can’t go back’.

Holly:   Yeah – you had already stepped up to that level.

Lisa:    Yeah, I’m not that same person so – ‘okay I will face forward and keep walking regardless of that’, so that’s the pieces the time to really step into it in your business, I feel, is when you feel you can’t go back. You cannot go backwards now because to go backwards would be to shove your little soul into a box, and that’s not what you came here to do and there is always a choice, but that’s not what you came here to do. So, I think that’s only four tips, but it seems like five, and I will just pretend it’s five.

Holly:   [Laughing] That’s okay – there is no minimum requirement for tips. I think that was excellent.

Lisa:    Okay great; there are x more tips…[laughing]

Holly:   [laughing] Thank you so much for joining us and sharing your tips and your experience, because I think – you – and the reason I asked you to be on this show – is that you are one of the top people I know who is just really practical, and clear, and open about your woo and I love that, so I am very happy to have you sharing your tips with us.

Lisa:    Thank you so much and you know that I just adore you and I think, you know, it is all a process, I guess that is what I wanted to say to people, it’s a process. Be kind to yourself, don’t rush it, but you know that it is available to you and just take one step and see what happens.

Holly:   Thank you.

Lisa:    Thanks Holly.

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Holly:   Our next guest is Rebecca Kane who guides people on their SHE’ros Journey by providing clarity, community and support to women who want to explore who they are at a really deep level. She does a lot of work with the moon phases, she is a kinesiologist and she does fantastic work in the real world. And Rebecca was recently a guest on episode 191, and I am super-excited to have her back on the show for this woo episode.

Holly:   Hello Rebecca, how are you?

Rebecca: Hey Holly, I am really good thanks, you?

Holly:   Good, let’s talk about woo.

Rebecca: Oh please!

Holly:   [laughing] okay! So, would you say that you are 100% open about your woo and your business, marketing and communications?

Rebecca: I would say, as of today: yes; when I started 17 years ago: no. But, 100% today. If people ask me any kind of woo stuff, I would wear it with honour.

Holly:   Excellent, so how would you make that transition from not being comfortable with it to where you are today?

Rebecca: I mean when I first started, you know what we would call woo, that term didn’t exist 17 years ago; and I hadn’t even told my family the kind of work that I was doing. Because, to me, although it has this term ‘woo’ it feels so natural to me, and it is actually quite difficult for me to remember that not everybody has this world view, and I will be talking about things and people will be like: ‘what on earth are you talking about?’ And I am like ‘hang on a minute let me just get out of that mindset’ [laughing].

            So, it actually took me, probably longer than it should do, and it almost felt like I had to come out of the spiritual closet as it were, and to own that this was a huge part of my work, but also my life. And I think just as I because more confident in the work that I was doing, in my own abilities, and who I was as a person – it just became that natural evolution that I was talking about it and because I was confident in who I was, and the discussions I was having, nobody questioned them. Yet, at the beginning, when I was just dipping my toe in the water and I was kind of a little bit unsure which path I was going to take – when I had those discussions with people who maybe weren’t as open – it was much easier for them to cut me down and for me to question everything. Whereas now I am just happy that everyone has their own world views and if you don’t agree with mine, that’s absolutely fine – I will listen and if I think I need to take anything on board, I am happy to do that – but, fundamentally I am happy in my little woo spiritual world.

Holly:   [laughing] So, is it just about taking baby steps for you, or how did you get over that fear of being woo?

Rebecca: I don’t think it was ever a majorly conscious decision, it really was just one of those things that just evolved as I evolved. My business grew, and I started offering more programmes that maybe had a more spiritual natural, or spoke much more about the energy of things? [Holly: um hmm] And then it just became so normal. And one of the really weird things was, when I just kind of claimed it for myself, people were like: ‘well I knew that about you anyway Rebecca’ and I was like ‘oh right, okay’. [laughing] So, I thought I was kind of toning it down, but people were still [Holly: picking up on it.] Yeah picking up on those vibes, which I guess we just do about people don’t we?

Holly:   Yeah. So, how did your business change once you started to be more comfortable and confident and open with this side?

Rebecca: I became much more aligned with me, and it was much more…the programmes that I was offering felt much more holistic -I felt much more passionate about delivering them. They grew and expanded and people got much better results; because, I suppose, I was turning up as me, standing in my truth and in my power, and of course your clients can only get the best results when you do that. And also, I was attracting the people that were resonant with that.

Holly:   Yes… you were stepping into your own truth, and your own power, and attracting the right people for you.

Rebecca: Yeah. And I just had the best clients.

Holly:   Yay! [laughing] So, what are your top tips for people who want to be more open about their woo, and really step into the power of this, but maybe are afraid to do so, and are not comfortable with it?

Rebecca: I think, for me, the biggest thing would be to ask why they are not comfortable about it? What is it? What fears are underlying? What do they think is going to happen? And of course, being a kinesiologist – being an energy clearer – I would strongly recommend you get some energy-clearing done around those fears, because while you have those fears, in this particular area of your life, they will be showing up in other areas too. And just because you decide to embrace that part of you more, it doesn’t mean that you have to shout it from the rooftops, it doesn’t even mean that you have to include everybody in those conversations; but it does mean that you have to accept all of you. And I strongly, strongly, believe that we need to accept all parts of ourselves: the good, the bad and the ugly.

Holly:   Um hm. So, what would be some baby steps that people could start taking to move towards this acceptance of themselves?

Rebecca: I guess one of the biggest things would be to find people that share your own views? You know, and realise that – actually – you are not alone in these views, that you are not some crazy person having visions and dreams with, you know, mad skills – but actually there are a whole lot of us out there, and it is just surrounding yourself with like-minded people. So, for example, when I first became involved with this I was probably like 19 or 20, and I had left university and when I went home my family thought I had joined a cult, because I had changed that much. [laughing] So, for my own family, they were not the best people to try and nurture these new beliefs and new skills – because it is like any plant isn’t it; you wouldn’t expect to put a tiny little seed, when it first germinates, and put it out in a thunderstorm and expect it to survive.

Holly:   Right.

Rebecca: You know, you would nurture it in the greenhouse, you would make sure that it had all the right nutrients, and when it turned into the might oak, then bring on thunderstorms; because it is more resilient at that stage. And I think the same is with you know spirituality, or the woo, or whatever you want to call it. When you are first kind of dipping your toe in that water, and you are first learning and discovering those things, I think the most important thing you can do is just surround yourself with like-minded people; so that you have somewhere where you are safe, where you can explore your new discoveries and everything that comes with it – because it really is like the matrix, once you take that pill, there is no going back.

Holly:   [laughing] I like that analogy, and I completely agree, because you are stepping more into the fulness of who you are.

Rebecca: Yeah. And that can sometimes be hard for those people around us – who expect us, or have always known us to be a particular way – it can be hard for them to understand and accept kind of like the ‘new’ you – but of course you are not ‘new’ you are just revealing more of your truth. So, yeah, it is about getting the right support around you, and just always, always – I would say that your intuition is like a muscle – and it is just always checking back in with yourself.

Holly: Yes, yes, I love that.

Rebecca: And, of course, you will strain, and of course you will make decisions that you know in your heart are wrong; you will still make for the rational choices, but it is always just checking back in with yourself: why are you doing it? why are you making that decision? Why do you want to follow that path? And if you use that internal check-in as your like your north star, or your soul compass, or whatever, you want to call it, you are not going to go too far wrong.

Holly:   Mm excellent advice, thank you so much.

Rebecca: You are so welcome.

Holly:   It has been a pleasure to have you on this episode, and I look forward to sharing it so thank you.

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Holly:   Our next guest is Joanna Hennon, who is a channel who works with the spirit guides. She helps people to step into their greatness, by accessing their soul wisdom and taking soul-inspired action. Joanna has been a guest on 3 previous episodes: 86, 158 and 178. I am super-excited to have her on the show, talking about woo, and why she hates the word.

Holly:    Hey Joanna!

Joanna:          Hey Holly!

Holly:    So, let’s talk about woo.

Joanna:          Okay.

Holly:   All right. So, would you say that you are 100% open about your woo in your business marketing communications?

Joanna:          You know, I want to say yes; but in fact, probably not 100%. So… yeah.

Holly:   Okay. So, what percentage would you say?

Joanna:          Probably about 85%

Holly:   Ooh that’s interesting! And what do you think would make up that 15% that’s missing?

Joanna:          So, I am about to go public with it now on this interview, I suppose [laughing] so it will be 100% when we are done – and I feel very comfortable sharing most of my woo side, so: I am channel, I work with energies all the time; but what I have kept back is some of the – I guess what I consider is the weirder stuff – maybe the specific energies that I work with, and some of the extra-terrestrial stuff that I am interested in, and the star-seed stuff I am interested in. And I have recently started talking about the parallel-reality stuff that I am interested in, so that maybe bumped up the percentage a little bit. [laughing]

Holly:   [laughing] Excellent. So how, when you first started working with this stuff, how did you get over fear of judgement about this kind of woo work?

Joanna: Well, I was kind of forced into it I suppose, because when I started out I really wanted to not use the word soul, or spiritual, or anything like that; which for someone who channels is really [laughing] difficult. And I remember my first emails to friends, and acquaintances, announcing that I am starting this business, and all these things, like: nobody would know what I was talking about because I was just trying to describe what I do, without using the key part of what I do. So, I kind of had to embrace it more and start talking about it more, because it was basically keeping me really stuck, because nobody could understand what I meant.

Holly:   Right! Like, what does she do?, how, what?’ [laughing]

Joanna:          [laughing] exactly. So at least once I said… I actually wrote a blog post called: ‘How I came out of the channeling closet’ at the time; and, yeah, I just had to decide to start being more open about it, and start – it wasn’t even a decision to be more open about it – it was just being really clear about what I do. Just having that confidence to say: ‘yeah I talk to these things that are invisible and that most people don’t believe exist…’ [laughing]

Holly:   [laughing]

Joanna:          And they have all this wisdom! [laughing]

Holly:   [laughing] So how did your business change once you started to be more open about this?

Joanna:          Well, people started hiring me, because they knew what I did. [laughing]

Holly: [laughing] That’s a good start.

Joanna:          I think you it is one of those polarising things, right? if you are working with…if that’s an integral part of your work – and channeling is a super-integral part of my work as a soul wisdom mentor – so my whole work is about helping you align with who you really are – which is a soul – like, I can’t actually leave that out and still be clear. So, when it is an integral part of your work you just have to go for it.

Holly:   You have to just get over yourself.

Joanna: Yeah, basically [laughing].

Holly:   So, what are your top tips for people who want to be more open about this, because it is an important part of their work, but they are scared of judgement, or they are just afraid of what people are going to think?

Joanna:          Well, I would say, take small steps, you know, like if you are in any groups where you feel safe, start talking about it there, maybe, or start talking about it with some friends, business friends even, who you trust? You know, because it is really… It is less a matter of kind of seeing how people react, and more a matter of you practising saying it.

Holly:   Ooh I like that, yeah.

Joanna:          Right? And so what words work for you, how to say so that are comfortable. And eventually, it is like with anything, once you like say it a few times, it is the same concept as your elevator speech for your business, right?

Holly:   Right!

Joanna:          You just practise saying it over and over, and then you will see how you feel saying different versions, and then you get to keep one [Holly: laughing] , Or if you are me you can’t decide [laughing].

Holly:   You just keep changing…

Joanna:          Yeah.

Holly:   So it is about figuring out what language works for you?

Joanna:          Yeah, I think so. The language reflects what you want to say. And it is not about kind of telling the world, that you work with energy, or that your channel, because honestly nobody cares about that, right? It is what you want to convey with that message: so, if your message is about being more confident, then you can use that as a story, right? If your message is about being more visibly authentic, then you can use that as a story. It is not actually the thing, that matters, right? It is kind of your intention behind the thing and why you want to share. So there is no point, like if it is not an integral part of your work, like, if you are a marketing coach, and it doesn’t really matter, then you don’t need to talk about it if you don’t want to. There are plenty of people who don’t.

Holly:   Yep, that makes sense.

Joanna:          And it is not necessarily because they are scared, right? It is just because they want to keep their options open in terms of clients. It is not important for them that the client believes in the woo stuff.

Holly:   Right, right.

Joanna:          But if it’s a really integral part – or piece – of your work, then it is important for you that your clients also believe in it, that you don’t have to convince anybody, that you don’t have to defend it. All those kinds of things.

Holly:   Mm hmm.

Joanna:          And then you find the right language to talk about it, so that people are attracted to you.

Holly:   Mm yeah, that makes sense. So, one of the things that I have been hearing from some of the other women that I have been talking to about this, is that they believe it’s not woo, it is real. It is just a part of their lives and they don’t necessarily even resonate with the word woo. So, how do you feel about the word ‘woo’?

Joanna:          I HATE the word woo.

Holly:   Ohhhh! Good!!! thank you for saying that.

Joanna:          I absolutely cannot stand it. [Holly: laughing] Like, I feel like there is this whole…there are layers and layers of judgement, in this one little word.

Holly:   Okay. Let’s talks about this.

Joanna:          It is like woo is not real, like people say: ‘oh yeah I am a marketing coach, so I don’t use any woo stuff’. Like, it is only like real practical stuff, like… it is not like that, it is not like we have the ‘real’ stuff and then we have this other stuff that doesn’t exist and it is fluffy and not useful and you shouldn’t really be spending your money on buying those services. It is not that. It is, like, it is the other part of your success, and it is where you come from, it is like, if you are rejecting all of that, then it is like you are rejecting who you really are.

Holly:   Yeah, that makes sense. So, but for some people, like for myself, the woo, okay I am going to keep using the word, because we know what it is, the woo element is really, important. Like, you know, I always talk about Lisa Wechtenhiser, for me the main part of working with her as my business coach, or business mentor is that she channels my spirit guides; and that’s the important part for me. If she just the business coaching I wouldn’t be as jazzed about working with her.

Joanna: Sure

Holly:   So, what words, and what language, would you recommend people use, or what do you use, to express that special element, of the work that you do?

Joanna:          There are lots of words that people use, I see a lot of ‘intuitive’ business coaches…

Holly:   Yes!

Joanna:          That’s one right? Or just intuitive a in general who also kind of do business stuff right?

Holly:   Yeah.

Joanna:          The word I use, personally, and I think I am the only one as far as I know who uses this term, is ‘soul-led’; because for me it is not only about being in touch with it, but about letting it steer you – so letting your true self steer you, rather than…so it is playing from a place of greatness, rather than the smallness that you think you are. So, yes, I use soul-led. I have seen lots of similar words: ‘spiritual’ ‘spiritual business mentor’ – there are loads, all kinds of words to convey it – I think you have to find words that are…, that are really, really… comfortable – I am not going to say comfortable, not comfortable…

Holly:   Because sometimes it is not comfortable. [laughing]

Joanna:          Because I started out calling myself an ‘intuitive coach’, but I found that I wanted to call myself intuitive to avoid using the word ‘soul’.

Holly:   Yeah.

Joanna:          So, now using the word soul is really important to me and I get challenged on that all the time.

Holly:   Really?

Joanna:          Yeah, by business coaches, because they are like: but you are leaving all of these other people kind of out of your ideal client group – like, if you use ‘soul’ you are going to alienate a lot of people.

Holly:   Yeah that’s the idea.

Joanna:          For me, that’s the idea, I don’t want to kind of explain that to people.

Holly:   Yeah, you get it or you don’t, if you don’t get it …

Joanna: I want to kind of start… we start our work at that soul level. So, you need to kind of be okay with that from the start. You know?

Holly:   Yeah, exactly. [laughing] If you are uncomfortable with that term then you don’t want to go any further.

Joanna:          Indeed.

Holly:   Excellent, well thank you so much for joining us today, thank you so much for your tips and advice, and your disdain for the word woo.

Both:   [laughing]

Joanna: My pleasure.

Holly:   Thank you for listening on this double-length episode, to been useful; I hope you got some really good tips in there about how to make your woo a little bit more public, and how to be comfortable. There are lots of tips on taking baby steps in there to get a little bit closer to being more authentically you.

So you can visit the shot notes on this episode, as usual, at hollyworton.com/201 where you can find links to some of the things that we talked about, including links to all of our guests’ websites, and the other episodes they have been on.

So, as I mentioned at the beginning of this episode, the whole idea for this topic came from my private Facebook group, which I would love for you to join with me. It is called the ‘Business Mindset Alchemists’, and it is a group that is dedicated to exploring business mindset, and how you can get the mindset you need to step into your greatness and achieve your dreams. I have been getting a lot more active in the group lately, including lots of live-stream videos, that are kind of like mini-webinars, where you can get the change to ask me questions on a specific topic.

So, if you are a woman entrepreneur I would love to see you in there, so just go to: hollyworton.com/group and you will be redirected to the Facebook group. So, thank you again for listening, and remember to visit: hollyworton.com/201 for the show notes on this episode.  Thank you.